This is really a rhetorical question because I am convinced that the program (Hearts card game) by Microsoft DOES in fact cheat.I first noticed it on XP. But, I've REALLY noticed it on Vista. Here is what I mean.
I've played X amount of games. The game keeps track of overall stats. Whenever I go over a 38% win rate (which isn't really all that hot but it's respectable) the program starts to gain up on me and kick my ass. I mean, seriously. I get dealt hands that NO ONE could do anything with. I will lose over and over again; then, once I drop back down to 37%, I will start to win again (I'll be dealt hands that any idiot could shoot the moon with).
This has happened over and over again. I cannot get past 38%!
I looked this up on Google and someone said, "Well, I don't think it is cheating, rather, like with "real" people, once one person starts to get ahead, the computer might attempt to "gang up on you".
Ok, this is true. If you are playing with REAL people that are half-way respectable, they will, in likelihood, "gang up on you" if you are out ahead.
But, this is NOT what happens with the program. No, not at all. First off, "real people" can't deal you particular rotten hands over and over and over again. And, "real people" won't allow someone else to shoot the moon just to get YOU (not in my experience, anyway). But, the program continually allows one of the other players to shoot the moon (whilst I sit by unable to stop them and watch my opponents throw the Ace of Hearts or something on someone trying to shoot the moon...I mean...DUH!)
Obviously, this blog entry is meant to be somewhat mindless. A ramble, a rant. Man, this pisses me off, though, which is why I am writing about it.
I played one game this afternoon and just hit 38% AGAIN. Any guesses as to who will NOT win the next game?
Mrs. B
1,588 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 601 – 800 of 1588 Newer› Newest»I paid nothing for the game...and I got hosed! haha
Please! Somebody tell me WHY it is so f******** important for the game to win? It is just ungodly horrible what it does to make you lose in the last hand (or two or three). Just played a game where I ended up with lone AS, lone QS, and KS,QS last three hands. Took nearly 50 points, lost by 5. WHAT THE HELL? And don't even bother MS lackey, with "well, there bad luck involved" The game's a cheat and whoever is responsible for it is a cheat.
Wish I had an answer for you, partner, but I'm befuddled about it myself. I keep track of several things during games I play. Here's an interesting stat. Last 20 "no-pass" hands I've had QS 13 times, with more than two defenders 3 times. Kinda buckin' the odds there. I guess the MS boys will say it's just a streak. Soooo...I shouldn't see the queen for 70-80 hands now?
If they tried to run a game like this in a Las Vegas casino today, the gaming commission would be on them like sharks.
Aren't you proud MS?
Has anyone seen this one? First trick after club lead, instead of leading a spade,bot leads diamond duece or club trey, next bot plays diamond trey or club four, other bot dumps spade queen and, of course, I take the trick. Has happened 5-6 times in last half-dozen games. Seems like everybody's in on the scam but me.
Hell, if you ran a game like this in Vegas, the buzzards would find you behind a rock in the desert.
To the guy getting the "second trick punch in the throat" as I call it. It gets real interesting when you see it on a "no-pass" hand. That means one hand has to be DEALT void in diamonds, DEALT the QS, the other two hands have to be DEALT the 2 & 3 of diamonds, and one of them has to decide to eschew the standard spade lead and to guess right on the 50/50 choice between diamonds and clubs. Takes a lot of stars lined up right to pull it off, especially if the deal is fair and square.
Yeah, I like that little "orchestrated" play...serves as further proof of the game's card-stacking strategy.
Watch the discards. The game reneges on them every now and then. Thus, the human player is the only one that actually has to follow the rules. I'd call that cheating.
I just lost one of those games where I'm leading by a few points and one of the bots is about to bust. Then, the cheat mode kicks in again and deals me a lone spade (the queen) on hand number 12, a no pass hand, and I end up eating the queen and losing by a few points. Of course, the chosen one gets absolutely nothing on this last trick.
Did the programmers behind this game really think, and I use that term loosely, that players would not notice these things?
Again, anyone up for some online Hearts? This game is a total bore after awhile.
Three hands in a row taking four hearts with the five of hearts !?! Do they think we're too damn stupid to notice?
I used to play Texas hold-em with a group of guys one evening a week thru the winter months. There were about 10-12 of us normally. About once every couple of weeks somebody would hit quads (four of a kind). I remember ONE TIME there was two sets of quads on the same hand (in about a three year peiod) What would you think if the same guy started getting quads two or three times every week? That's what it feels like with this "gsme".
Notice how many times you are dealt a lone QS on the "pass left" hand. What the hell do you do? Hold it and eat it...or pass it, get passed the INEVITABLE KS or AS and eat it. Happens way more than it should if the dealing were fair. As near as I can figure, you should be dealt a singleton of anything about once in 8-10 hands. There SHOULD be a one in 52 chance it's the QS, then there's a one in four chance it'll be on the "pass-left" hand and a 50-50 chance the bot passing to you has the KS or AS. Should see it MAYBE once every 300 games or so? I got it twice in three games. Cheat? or just "bad luck", MS pimp?
I'm also convinced the game looks in your hand. If I'm void in a suit, it's like pulling teeth to get that suit led. If I'm void, doesn't that mean the other players have MORE cards in that suit and they should MORE likely to be led? Not with this cheating piece of crap.
I've caught the game cheating at times too. It definitely doesn't always follow the rules of play. I think that "misplayed" card usually comes out at the last trick so you can't really see it very long.
Yes, the game "knows" exactly what is in your hand. That's what essentially makes this game, if one can call it that, totally unlike the real game of Hearts. Besides the rigged "deals", knowing what cards you have at all times puts the human player at a serious disadvantage (to put it mildly). To compensate for this, the game has the support bots, or patsies, play stupidly most of the time. Thus, you're really only competing against the low score of the prima donna player. This is why there are so many x-x-0-0 or x-x-0-1 scores per hand. These battles along the way are designed to try to dump as many points on you as possible at the sacrifice of the patsies while protecting the prima donna from points. Hence, the game's fatal flaw is revealed in the process: the bots are not playing to win the game.
It's a stupid game. Whenever you're leading or challenging for the lead, or particularly when you're about to win, it always gives you a terrible hand (lone high spade, high hearts, no cards under six, etc., etc.).
Anyone can win a game when they're dealing the cards the way this game does. I'm not impressed. I'll stick to real games Microsoft.
Why ain't the guy who wrote this program working at the Pentagon? His simplistic brilliance is simply brilliant. Whenever the game needs the human to lose, just deal him short in spades, pass him the queen and lead at him. Wow! He could have the commies, the terrorists, or whoever else plots against US to their knees in no time. You're wasting your time and talent beating poor schlubs at hearts my good man.
I came up with a twist on the game I'm having a lot of fun with. I don't play to win the game, I play to beat the hell out of East. The goal is to make East bust. So far my record is 14 in a row. I don't care what my score is or who is the chosen one, just pummel East with as many points as possible so he LOSES. Why? I just don't like that guy.
Leading all bots by 40+ points, four hands in a row with queen and one or zero other spades. Go to hell MS.
The question isn't IF the game cheats, it does. The question is WHY? I've played several thousand games and I'm convinced that the card-rigging and other cheats are NOT to make the game "more challenging". They are designed to MAKE YOU LOSE certain games. But WHY? The ridiculous lengths the game goes to in forcing you to lose is dishonest, corrupt, and immoral. It should be an embarrassment to the entire corporation.
Agreed, partner. I don't see how being dealt a guaranteed point-taking hand on the last hand of a game can be defined a "challenge". Unless it's a challenge to your self-control. Minor miracle I haven't had to buy a new laptop about weekly.
Last 20 or so singletons on "no-pass" hands:
QS <
KH *
7D
KC
8C
KS <
JH *
QH *
4D
QS <
8D
AS <
AH *
5H
QS <
KD
9H *
KS <
2C
JD
Seven times almost automatic "eat the queen", 5 mor "4 heart" cards. Some long odds there.
There are absolutely games which YOU WILL NOT WIN. The deals will be stacked again and agin to give you points and protect the chosen one. When this is done by non-random, selective dealing, it is CHEATING. The game, it's creator, and the company behind it are cheats.
Hey, MS lackeys. How often do you have to get dealt lone QS, KS, AS on the "no-pass" hands before you call it cheating instead of "bad luck'? Four times in last 15 "no-pass" hands. Tough to beat the MS genius with "luck" like that.
It's a ridiculously rigged game.
Everyone knows it too.
Microsoft should be ashamed of even having their name associated with such an inferior product.
It's a complete and utter joke from a programming perspective as well.
Once you have the opportunity to study the game from a large collection of played games data, you can see that the card distributions are blatantly rigged. Rigging a game in anyone's favor is cheating.
This game is pointless to play.
It will protect the chosen one by ultimately giving you yet another crappy hand in the end (after surviving all the other crappy hands along the way). How many games have you lost at the very end by just a few points? How many games have you lost at the end by being dealt a high spade with one or no protectors? 13 points....there you go...you lose.
It happens over and over again because the deals are totally fixed.
That's pretty lame Microsoft.
I just played a 13 hand game in which I was dealt or passed the AKQ of Spades as a unit three times!
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.
What a joke this thing is.
Microsoft has never denied that the game is not honest.
I guess that means take it for what it is, a corrupt game.
I agree with Carl's earlier post. The game's goal SHOULD be to provide a challenging, thought-provoking game. It does this part of the time, but way too often it's just out and out cheating. From the blatant rigged deals to force the human into taking points, to protecting the "chosen one", to dumping on patsies to ensure the human loses. The goal is not to "challenge", but to "win". Why Microsoft?
I agree with you both.
Why does the game use such blatant card rigging?
Astronomical odds of the following occur in this game on:
1. Even distribution of 2,3,4,5 of Hearts.
2. South getting dealt/passed the 2 of Clubs, particularly on no-pass hands
3. South getting passed A,K,Q of Spades all at once
4. South getting dealt/passed some combination of A,K,Q of Spades on almost all hands.
5. East taking the first trick.
Etc., etc.
Add yours to the list.
You got to love how the game gets into super drive cheat mode as you get into the last few hands when you are leading. It pulls out all the stops to rig these hands against you. Some hands are just pure slams and there's nothing you can do about it but sit back, take the points and lose the lead in the process. Then one of the bots will usually go out on the very next hand and you end up finishing second.
I've seen this so many times that whenever I see one of these slams I usually don't even finish the game. Whoosh. New game.
By the by, I clear the stats after every game I play just as a matter of routine.
Here's another fatal flaw in the logic of the game. Ever notice that the bots will hold back their hearts until they can dump them on you, usually on the last few tricks. Since the cards are prearranged (i.e., rigged), and the game knows exactly what is in your hand, if the game can toss the lead back to you, it will do so, so that the bots can throw their hearts on you at the end. It does this even when you are not the low score.
This is the giveaway that the game is essentially a game of 3 on 1 and not a true game of Hearts wherein all players are actually trying to win.
They need to call this game something else since it really isn't Hearts when it comes right down to it.
Here's one - tight game - down to the last hand - hold 'em hand - I'm dealt 3,4.5 of diamonds. East has club ace (big surprise) - leads 2 of diamonds - I play the 3 - take a heart and the QS. Yep, east dealt the other ten diamonds. Oh yeah, one of the pasties busts and I lose by 4 points. Nice "challenge" MS.
Hehe.
I think I've played that exact same hand (fixed card distribution would be a better description) a few times in the past. Funny how all the cards are just in the right spot at that moment in the game, eh?
I just played a seven hand game in which the chosen one shot the moon three times. Three times in seven hands? I could have stopped the last one but at that point, given the point disparity, I didn't care and so I just let it play out.
Some games are just totally ridiculous like that.
Yeah, the repetitive nature of the plays in this game (can anyone say "2 of Clubs" on no pass hands) is a sure sign of the weakness of the programming behind the game. But that's what we've come to expect from Microsoft anyway.
The 2,3,4,5 of hearts distribution (I call it the "cutesy play") is kind of shrugged off by many, like "yeah, but no biggie". But it is a slow-killing poison. It's at least 4 points, possibly 8 if the "chosen one" would have taken the trick, and often more because you're still in the lead. How many games have you lost by 4 or fewer points? Was there a "cutesy" in there". Of course the "deal you short in spades and pass you the queen" is the A-bomb, but little bullets kill as well.
I agree with the previous posters. MS should be embarrassed to have their name on this piece of junk. I wish they would just leave this sort of crap off Windows one of these releases.
The game cheats. It reneges on discards when it serves its purpose.
It's hysterical how the game attempts to make itself look more legit by having the chosen one take a few points on the last hand of a game. I guess the programmers thought we wouldn't notice all the 0 point hands that preceded this last one. Yeah, right.
I've been using a new strategy of late. Whenever the game throws in a moon shot by the prima donna player early in a game (which happens a lot as you know), I just start a new game. Swoosh. New game.
Yes, it cheats. Rigging the cards to win. How pathetic is that?
Since the game knows exactly what's in your hand (which is totally rigged anyway) at all times, what's really the point of playing this ridiculous game? Contrary to what the programmers probably believed, the rigging of the game takes the fun out of it for most people and they quickly tire of it.
Also damn sick of FINALLY getting four protectors with the QS only to have one of the bots with 5 spade to STILL lead it out of me. I call BS!
I had a two game win streak. Game 3, first hand dealt lone QS, passed it left, got passed KS. East takes club trick, leads spade. Second hand, dealt void in spades, get passed AS, KS. East takes club trick, leads spade, west dumps QS.
Third hand.... are you KIDDING? KAWHOOSH there was no third hand.
Now getting a lot of "mini-cutesy"-four of hearts takes 4 hearts (one bot void).Had this game earlier tonite.
Hand 1- 4 pts. 5,4,3,2 of hearts
2- 3 pts. 4,3,2 of hearts
3- 4 pts. 5,4,3,2 of hearts
4-13 pts dealt lone QS
5- 0 pts.
6- 0 pts.
7- 3 pts. 4,3,2 of hearts
8-17 pts dealt lone KS
9- 0 pts.
10- 0 pts.
11- 0 pts.
12- 8 pts.dealt K,J of hearts
Lost game 52-49
How do I "save" a game result? I want to send it to the programmer's mommy so she can put it on the fridge.
I've seen all the cheats mentioned in the posts. Does anyone notice the just plain, crappy hands? Like 9 or 10 cards 9 and above? Or all face cards in clubs, diamonds, and spades and the 3,4,6,7 of hearts? Or the opposite, nothing above a 6 in the other suits and A.Q,J,10,9 of hearts? I had a hand yesterday (in a close game, of course) where I had nothing above a 7 in clubs, diamonds, and hearts...and a void in spades. Naturally, I get passed the queen and lose the game.
I know what you mean by your reference to crappy hands with nothing under 9. The game is plain ridiculous sometimes with how blatant the card stacking is. Some games you just aren't going to win because of this. You have the right idea. Woosh! Just start a new game and forget the last one.
COMPLETELY AND UTTERLY RIGGED GAME.
WE DELETE ALL MS BLOATWARE WHEN WE CONFIGURE OUR COMPUTERS AT WORK.
BUT MS IS SLOW TO LEARN SO WE'LL KEEP DOING IT I GUESS.
Ever notice how frequently West plays after you on key tricks? Gee, I wonder why that is.
Ever wonder why your hand is so lacking in low cards late in a game when you're leading? Gee, I wonder.
Ever wonder why there are so many hands that end up with the x-x-0-0 or x-x-0-1 scoring? Gee, I wonder.
You get the idea. Stating the number of ways this supposed game is rigged would produce a very long list indeed. It's been fun reading all these comments from my fellow Hearts fans.
Yup, this game has plenty of ways to cheat you. My favorite is the moon shot by the chosen one on the very last hand that causes you to finish second. I think some poster before called it the "miraculous comeback" play.
If you play Windows Hearts, keep this in mind: you're the only player that DOESN'T know what's in each other player's hand. Seems sort of silly to play the game once you consider this.
I've gotten the "cutesy play' at least once per game for nine games in a row and counting. Four times on first hand of game. Am I stuck in some kind of computer rut or warp?
In ONE game, I took the queen with 4 of clubs (on 2nd trick), 4 of diamonds (on 2nd trick), and 4 of hearts. It must be a matter of national security that I lose that game.
How's this rank for crappy hand? Hand #12, leading by 15 points
Clubs-A,K,Q,10
Diamonds-A,Q,J,7
Spades-A,Q
Hearts-Q,J,3
Hold-em hand, I take 22, bot sitting on 98 takes the heart trick, game over!
It's interesting reading all these shared experiences from playing this lousy game. Our class project showed without any evidence to the contrary that the "deals" are entirely rigged. For example, the consistent even distribution of the 2,3,4,5 of Hearts is achieved despite the astronomical odds of this occurring randomly.
Adding to some comments from an earlier poster...
You are also the only player that is actually required to follow the rules of play.
Somethung else that most of us suspect, but can't prove is collusion in the passing of cards. I was at a friend's house last winter and he had found a "cheat" on the internet that allowed you to see all the cards. I watched him played 6 or 8 games. I didn't see any cards "move" from one bot to another during a hand, but their passes were well coordinated. If one bot passed three small hearts, he didn't receive three big ones, etc. That explains a lot of the lopsided hands where a bot will have 8-9 diamonds and be void in clubs. We watched the passes closely and not once did a bot receive what he had passed fom another bot. Admitedly a small sample of less than 100 hands, but interesting.
Oh yeah, he kicked the computer's ass playing like this. Kinda sweet.
It has got to be a matter of national security to cheat so bad to make me lose a game. Nothing else would warrant that level of dishonesty. Three cutesy plays, dealt the QS on all three "no-pass" hands. The country is safe my friends, MS beat me at hearts.
I kept track for 20 games. I took 4 hearts with the 5 of hearts 18 times. The other three players did the same 9 times TOTAL. Admittedly there could have been a few more, when the last to play took the trick with a high card rather than the 5, but sure as hell not enough to account for even close to believeable odds. WHY does this game have cheat so bad?
Yeah, that egg in the XP version is pretty neat. I guess that's why they eliminated it in later versions. Watching the coordination of the passes demonstrates the total card stacking that the game relies upon. I don't know if one can call it collusion (since you're really not playing against three individual players), but it is further proof that the whole game is built upon rigged dealing rather than random play.
It's sad when a game programmer has to resort to such blatant card rigging instead of developing a more sophisticated 4-player game strategy. This really is a game of one-on-one and not a true game of Hearts. It fails miserably in that the rigged "dealing" has the effect of causing waning human player interest over time. If MS insists on continuing to bundle their affiliated games with each successive version of Windows (read: bloatware), then perhaps they could actually spend some bucks on a product that actually plays a true game of Hearts rather than this very inferior game.
Crappy (rigged) hands? Oh yeah, you bet ya!
Hand #4 (no pass hand of course):
Clubs - 2,3,8,A (the infamous 2-A combo)
Diamonds - A
Spades - 8,K,A
Hearts - 3,10,Q,K,A
Gee, with all those aces I should have been playing poker. So, this was one of those moon shot teasers where it led right back at me with spades so I sucked up the queen in no time but hearts was not broken. KS played, still not broken. AD played, not broken. AC played, nope, still not. 8C, and there goes my moon shot with a heart discard going to North who then proceeds to force out the rest of my hearts. So I get the bulk of the points with North scraping up the rest. Prima donna player was untouched of course.
I had a similar deal recently. I had the only spade left (the queen), the only clubs left, and the 3 and 5 of hearts(which hadn't been broken). All I needed to do was take one heart, lead the trey, and I was home free. I led club after club, but a heart wouldn't fall. Finally I was forced to lead the queen and, of course, three hearts quickly followed and I got saddled with 16 points on a hand that should have been 1 or 2.
Just played a game where I was trailing the chosen one by 35 points. Hold-em hand, got dealt lone QS, also got the cutesy play later in the hand. My God, MS, if you HAVE to win that bad,,,,,
The game is flawed in so many different ways, all hinging on the premise that the bots are not actually playing to win but rather just to see you lose. Thus, the bots won't throw points at another player unless it serves their collective purpose, i.e., busting one of them while you are not in the lead. Once you see the original card distributions for each hand (have 4 friends take notes while you play) you can see that the game will deliberately avoid throwing the Queen of Spades at another bot when that option arises. Instead, it will be thrown at you the first chance it gets. Thus, this does not even come close to behaving like the real game of Hearts.
It still comes down to selective dealing rather than random. When I played hold-em poker, I'd get beat holding a full house...on rare occasion, not every third time or some such BS. I saw quad jacks go down to a straight flush...ONCE, not every time we played. The 100-1 long shot wins...about once in a hundred tries, not 2 or 3 times every race day. How many of you have won a lottery? Hell, it's tough to win a turkey in the Christmas drawing at the local supermarket.
I agree. The game is completely unreal. It may be fun for awhile, but most people quickly lose interest in playing it once they see how rigged it is. That holds true for any game that is rigged. Once a player realizes this, they quickly move on to something else. That's why the game fails so miserably. A game should be designed to keep your interest; Windows Hearts does just the opposite. Grade: Fail.
I got hosed for 22 points on the first hand, ended up with 29. Chosen one ended up with 11. Nice "challenge", MS.
Lost a game tonight I was leading by about 10 points late. Had a good hand, should have been a zero pointer. I took 24 points. How? Every damn bot had about 8-9 cards of one suit. Every time I played a 4, one bot would play the 3 and the two would dump points or shuck big cards. I mean the whole damn hand. I don't think one human out of ten could have laid the hand out like that. It was the most unbelievable cheat I've seen...and I've seen a lot of them.
And when all else fails, the "brilliant" programming built into the game can always stick you with a solitary spade (A,K,Q...take your pick) on the next no-pass hand. There you go....13 points just like that....you finish second.
That's some pretty lame programming if you ask me.
Yeah, I saw a similar deal not long ago. I took the queen with the 3 of hearts...on a "no-pass" hand. I held 4 hearts, two bots were void, and the last one held the other 9.
I lost a game 11-4. 4 lousy points for the chosen one. Could NOT get a damn thing to stick to him.
Been playing this ugly game awhile now, I am 74% but can't get the 75%.When they cheat I exit game n go to my game for hearts,It consist of K&5 of clubs, 2&Q diamonds,Q,6,5,3 Spades, A,k, 10,8,2 hearts.Beat um everytime give every card back 2 um,lol...just can't get 75% n I have played many games since 74%...
I agree with the comments above. This game clearly demonstrates how NOT to write a game program. The idea of any game program is to maintain the player's interest. On the contrary, the card stacking employed in this crappy game causes the player to lose interest rather quickly. Thus I agree with the grade assigned by the poster above, a big fat "F".
Here's the challenge to you Microsoft game affiliate. How about designing a true game of Hearts that plays like the real game with random card dealing? You've struck out on this challenge thus far.
The game is ridiculously rigged and everyone who has ever played it knows it.
It can stick you with points anytime it wants, particularly on every fourth hand. For example, I recently played a game where I got stuck with 16 points on hand #4, 15 points on hand #8 and 12 points on hand #12. I finished in second place with a score of 75-69. Gee, I wonder if those no pass hands had anything to do with it?
Yes. It cheats. Any card game that rigs the deals would be considered a cheat.
Do people really still play this game, even though it's such a confirmed cheat?
Great blog. Glad I found it.
What's with the 2 of Clubs on every damn no pass hand? This game is so repetitive that it sucks out any enjoyment that one might actually obtain from playing it.
Dull, dull, dull.
I agree that it's a pretty dull game after awhile. I mean you can only get the QS dealt to you on so many hands, especially the no pass ones, before you just say why bother.
It's a shame it's such a pitiful game as I'm sure there are many people out there like myself that enjoy the real game of Hearts.
Well, somehow I triggered hyper-cheat again. I've lost 11 of 13. Gotten cheated in every way imaginable. Juat getting killed with hearts. Just finished a game where I was dealt over 25 hearts in the first 7 hands, the lowest one was an 8. Lowest heart passed to me was a jack. After 7 hands I trailed the chosen one 46-4. Lost another game where the chosen one took 3 points in an 11 hand game. I got dealt the QS 7 times in a row on no-pass hands over three games. and so on and so on....
I suppose you MS shills would say just a bad streak. Yeah, right.
It's a streak alright, partner. A brown one, right down the backof the programmer's shorts.
Whenever I get into a hypercheat streak like your talking about I tell it to go pull down it's pants and cheat itself. I just keep flushing until it knocks it the f*** off. It will eventually. It might take a dozen games, but it's not hard work to click "start new game".
Last four games, EVERY, yes EVERY time I managed to get the queen to the chosen one, he shot the moon. 5 times! Three of those times I was down by about 15 looking to at least pull even, and ended up down by 40.
How can you even PRETEND it's a fair game? What crap.
For those who think it's just "bad luck" or whatever. Last 11 "no=pass" hands:
SPADES
Q-7
K-Q
Q
A-10
K-9
Q-J-9
A-K
J-10
A-Q
K-J-4
Q-8
23 SPADES Q-6,K-4,A-3
Simple odds say I should get about 38 spades and about 8 total A,K,Q
Isn't it amazing how the chosen one can shoot the moon with no problem every time it wants? Of course, when you have an opportunity for it, there's always that one card that beats yours and you lose that one key trick.
This is a outrageously rigged game. What the heck were they thinking when they wrote the program? Did they think players wouldn't notice this? I agree with the earlier poster. It has the effect of causing people to lose interest in the game in the end.
Yeah, what is up with that 2 of clubs thing on just about every no pass hand? I call BS on that maneuver.
I just had a run of 13 wins in a row. Now, in game 14, I have been passed the QS on EVERY one of nine hands thus far. I'm still in second place but one of the bots is about to go bust while the chosen one has all of 3 points. Give me a break. Again, this game makes little effort to disguise how blatantly rigged it is.
Woosh....new game and new stats coming up.
13 in a row? WOW! Every time I'm lucky enough to win 3 or 4 I get the "new guy in prison" treatment.
Haha. This game isn't for real now, is it? I always thought that this was sort of an inside joke for the programmers because it's just that bad. A serious programmer just could not produce such a piece of junk.
Agreed. The programming the game uses is very weak. The tactics employed are extremely repetitive. For example, take positioning. Ever notice how often you are playing in front of West? This is by design of course to put you at a competitive disadvantage. And don't even get me started on the "dealing".
Why design a game that puts the (human) player at a competitive disadvantage from the others? Why not use equal footing as in a true game of Hearts? Clearly the programmers of this game thought that this would keep the game "challenging" and players would continue to play. Sadly, it has the opposite effect once players realize how rigged the game is.
If I wanted to waste some time, I'd take a good crossword puzzle over this mess any day.
THERE'S ABSOLUTELY NO DOUBT THAT THIS GAME IS RIGGED. THUS, IT HAS NO LEGITIMACY WHATSOEVER.
I really doubt you could program a "real" Hearts game. There is just so much human element involved. I played with a guy that, unless someone had taken a heart, was ALWAYS a threat to shoot the moon. Another guy played like every point he took was a personal affront, etc., etc.You had to know these guys and play accordingly. You didn't dare pass the first guy a heart over a nine and you could count on the second guy to duck a trick if someone just LOOKED like he might play a heart. I doubt you could duplicate that kind of stuff in a computer game.
That being said, ridiculous card rigging to make the game "competitive isn't the answer, either.
The game plays like a broken record. No pass hand = give South the 2C.
Have West hold QS = pass South the A and KS, have East take trick before leading a spade. Etc., etc., etc.
It gets very boring pretty quickly.
Try to start a game without getting dealt or passed the A, K, or Q of spades. The first hand of the game is quite often one of the most rigged ones.
The game does outright cheat at times in that the bots will throw a bogus discard. You have to watch carefully since the held card will usually get thrown into the muck on one of the last couple of tricks. How incredibly lame.
Our class project demonstrated beyond any doubt that the game is dishonest. There are so many other significantly better options out there. Don't waste your time with this junk.
When a game program relies upon stacking the cards in order to defeat you, that's just some very lazy programming. It's no wonder that they give this game away with Windows; they certainly would never be able to actually sell it as a valid game program.
I don't buy this crap that it's too difficult to program a competitive game. It can sure as hell program a cheat to "win" the game. I led by 14, took the queen and a heart with the 4 of clubs and three hearts with the 4 of hearts, lost by three points. If it's capable of analyzing a game situation and rigging the cards to give you just enough points to lose, I think it should be capable of playing a fair game. Or is cheating the company standard?
I agree 100%. If half the time and effort had been spent developing strategies for the individual bots to "win" instead of cheats to make the human "lose", you might have a worthwhile game. But no, you chose dishonesty and will always be a CHEAT in my book.
I don't really care what it could be or should be. What it IS is a poorly programmed game that uses blatant card stacking to make you lose. No, it's not "competitive", it's flat out cheating and many times doesn't even stimulate interest by creating a "wiggle out of it" opportunity. Often it just deals you high spades and leads you into the queen. No chance. Pure BS.
I only wish the Vista version still had that hidden egg in it like the XP version did that allowed you to see all the cards as they were dealt. I suspect that the Vista version doesn't actually set the bot cards until after you have chosen your pass cards. (A good way to test this theory is to not try to void a suit or pass point cards and see what you get in return. Ever notice that you are frequently given cards back that just replace what you passed?) Who knows. Maybe the bot cards are not even set at all, but rather are just place holders. It does seem that they always seem to have just the right card to play in order to stick it to you and protect the chosen one in the process. I wouldn't be surprised if this turned out to be the case given the lengths this game seems to go to make you lose.
I agree. This is some lazy programming. The interesting thing is that it produces the opposite effect from what was intended, i.e., players losing interest over time. That is the ultimate test of any computer game and this game has flunked badly.
What bugs me most about Windows Hearts is how repetitive it is. Come on. How many times can East take the 2C trick and then lead out with spades because it knows you have the A or K and West is holding the Q? Please. This is just one example, but as you know if you've played the game for any period of time there are many other examples of its repetitiveness.
I used to occasionally enjoy playing it while waiting for a flight, etc. but now I don't even bother to play that often. It's gotten rather boring seeing the same ploys used over and over.
Microsoft has always had integrity issues. Remember it was the courts that finally forced them to stop bundling IE as the default browser with Windows. They didn't do that voluntarily.
And yes it totally cheats. I just played a game in which I was passed the Queen of Spades on 9 of 10 hands. 9 times out of 10 hands. Seriously? And two of those passes were the infamous A,K,Q trio. What a freaking joke.
Do they really think we're too stupid to notice getting set up for the QS or enough hearts on the last hand to lose the game? I mean really? The first few hundred times I thought it was just coincidence, but now I'm starting to wonder.....
Gosh! Really? Do you mean about every other "no-pass" hand when I get dealt the ace of spades, east takes the first trick, leads a spade, and west drops the queen on my ace, it's not just random luck?
Hehe. Love the sarcasm. I'm right there with you fellow Hearts fan (but not a fan of this game that dares call itself Hearts).
Here's a recent game I just played that illustrates your point. I lose the game on the 12th hand through one of those false moon shot set-ups whereby you are dealt just impossible cards, get stuck with the QS right away, then give the moon shot a try only to discover that there is only one other player holding hearts, they save a higher heart for the last trick, and you end up with 24 points, dropping you out of first place.
1 - 4, 0, 22, 0
2 - 14, 0, 12, 0
3 - 4, 6, 0, 16
4 - 0, 1, 0, 25
5 - 1, 15, 10, 0
6 - 0, 0, 6, 20
7 - 0, 5, 8, 13
8 - 1, 0, 25, 0
9 - 5, 7, 0, 14
10 - 6, 13, 4, 3
11 - 7, 13, 1, 5
12 - 24, 0, 0, 2
13 - 0, 1, 6, 19
Game over (2nd place) - Final scores:
S = 66
W = 61
N = 94
E = 117
Nothing coincidental about it all!
Just finished a similar "game" (I use the term loosely). I'm leading the chosen one by 11 points going into hand #12 (no-pass). Not even a PRETENSE of fairness. I'm dealt singleton QS, spades led, I lose. It was over as soon as the phony "shuffle" ended. I don't know why the cards even appeared. Why not just add 13 to my and pop up the little "sorry, but you lose, you inferior little schlub."
cudos to dancingwithangels for winning 74% of the time. I have crawled from 59% to 63%(1800 games). one recent strategy ... never pass spades.
NEVER complain about MS hearts shooting the moon. that is your problem most of the time(90%). if you prepare to take one heart trick each hand(4 points), the bots will rarely shoot the moon.
cutesy play ... you are a fool to fall for this one. NEVER lead the 5H(duh).
The most obvious indication that the game is rigged: the consistent even distribution of the 2,3,4 and 5 of Hearts. That little ploy results in what can only be termed lottery-like odds. (Oh, and I think you know who gets the 5.)
"Never lead the 5H (duh)" What sound advice! What if east leads the 2H? Go ahead and concede the 4 points and play your 8 or J? What if your choice is the 5H or one of your big clubs? or big diamonds? One of the points I've tried to make is the "cutesy" is often MORE than a four-point punch in the throat. I recently got nailed with 24 points because I got "cutesied", couldn't get out of the lead and got clobbered.
i posted several months ago about how the MS "cheating" was a two-edged sword. Not just the disadvantage it puts you at, but the psychology of "changing your game" out of fear of the cheat.
All card games are basically based on odds.
You have GOT to be able to lead the 5H knowing ther's a 75% chance or better that someone else will take the trick. You can't "assume" you will be cheated. If you are, you are, it's still the right play. Same with "never pass this" or "always pass this". If you are dealt a lone AS, pass the damn thing. You can't just hold it and eat the queen 'cuz your afraid of being passed the queen. Once you start trying to outguess the cheats, your whole game will be messed up and your losing will increase.
I'm really skeptical of a 74% win rate unless it's just a couple hundred games or he's somehow "dumping" games without them showing as loses.
Whenever I get the overly used ploy of getting passed a bunch of cards in the same suit, just so one of the bots can lead in that suit because they know that West is void in it and holding the QS, I just dump that game and start again. They're not fooling anyone; you can see it coming from miles away. This overly used tactic proves that the game uses the bots as a single player trying to make you lose. So, it's not really anything like a true game of Hearts where you actually play against three other players each trying to win. This is a game of 3-on-one that is just trying to make you lose. It may be based on the game of Hearts, but it's nothing like it. Thus, it's a big failure as far as I'm concerned.
That's the only "strategy" I've figured out, dump the cheating SOB. I know I dump too many games and my win % suffers, but I'm on blood pressure meds anyway and don't nedd the aggravation. I WILL NEVER continue a game I trail by 30-40 points. It's totally fruitless. Every time you manage to put some points one the chosen one and tighten up the game, you will invariably be dealt short in spades, passed the queen and fall behind again. I've seen it so many times that I refuse to even pursue it. I've dumped dozens of game on the second hand. If I get force-fed 20+ points on hand #1 and see the cheat is on for hand #2, KAWHOOSH!
Dug out some notes...
Per our class project, whenever the QS was not in South's hand, it was being held by West a whopping 72% of the time.
It's a BS game and that's about all there is to it.
Yeah, and do you notice east is ALWAYS in the lead?! It seems like every damn card you play, you have weigh whether you want to run in thru two other hands.
Yup. That's the other part of this game's most overused strategy: make sure East takes that first trick and then leads out against you.
It gets pretty predictable (read, boring) after you've seen it a few hundred times.
HEY MICROSOFT. SAVE US SOME TIME AND AGGRAVATION. WHEN YOU DECIDE TO CHEAT US OUT OF A GAME, JUST HAVE A LITTLE POP UP SAY "SORRY, BUT YOU WILL NOT BE ALLOWED TO WIN THIS GAME" WHEN WE PRESS START.
Windows Hearts is a complete and utter joke in the world of computer games.
You can say that again. It clearly was written by some very amateur-level programmers. But, hey, it's a freebie so no worries.
hehe, I like that pop-up idea. Maybe they could include that in the next version. Or maybe they could have the cards light up and blink when "cheat mode" is on, like Ms. PacMan. Or maybe, they could just NOT have it cheat!
If there's a stats or odds expert out there, tell me the odds on this - four CONSECUTIVE "no-pass" hands (in two games)
lone QS
lone QS
lone KS
AS-JS
To the "class project" poster. Any stats on the difference between spades being led when the human holds the QS as opposed to one of the bots? Seems like if I hold the queen, spades are ALWAYS led. If I'm NOT holding the queen, other suits are led, especially one that I have big cards in.
I don't know what's going on, but my game has become a freaking cartoon. Last night I lost 6 in a row. One game I took QS with 3D, 3H, and 4H. Another game I was leading 34,65,95,92. Got dealt lone QS on "hold-em" hand, took 24 points. Got dealt lone QS on "pass left" hand. Passed it, got passed the ace, took 17 points and lost. Another game "chosen one" won with 6 points. and on and on. What a morally bankrupt organization.
ps. WOW! my word verification for this is "porking"
What about the collusion between the bots? Just finished a game I was leading by 9-10 pts., a bot had already busted, and I was holding 2D, JH, QS. The only remaining spade was the king. It was east's lead. If he leads a heart, I probably take the trick (and 3 or 4 pts.), lead the 2D and dump the QS on last trick. If he leads a club, I dump the queen. No he leads a diamond and robs my deuce. West takes the trick. If he leads a diamond or club, I dump the queen, or if he holds the KS, I'm home free. Nope he leads a heart, north dumps the KS, I take the trick and have to lead QS and lose the game.
Too many times the cards seem to lay just right and the bots play it just right for it to be "chance".
Yeah, I've seen that sort of "collusion" so many times I've lost count. The right cards just seem to be in the right place and played to perfection to stick it to you. It makes one wonder if the cards in the bot hands aren't really fixed at all, but rather are just place holders. That certainly would make the execution extremely easy.
It's a BS game and everyone knows it.
I just played a game that I was leading through 7 hands until the full-strength cheat kicked in. The chosen one then went seven hands without picking up a single point. Of course, I got crap hands from that point forward. West dumped the QS on me 3 times over the last seven hands and once I had to eat it as it was my only spade on a no-pass round. I agree with you pal. This game is complete bull****.
The game cheats by stacking cards. The number of x-x-0-0 scoring hands is a clear marker of a Hearts game program that is fixing the deals. It doesn't fool anyone and shows how weak the programming truly is. I'd have to agree with the previous posters who gives this game a failing grade.
RIGGED FROM START TO FINISH. ENOUGH SAID.
This is just more MS bloatware that very relatively few people actually want on their computers these days. Of course, MS is out of touch on this as usual.
I was trailing the chosen one by 4 pts. going into hand #12. I thought maybe I could lay a heart trick on him and scrounge a tie or, with a bit of luck......nope....dealt lone QS.
If the g-damn programmer put a fraction of the effort into making a realistic game as he did with all the g-damn cheats, he might be worth the powder it'd take to blow him to hell.
I agree with most of the other posters on here. This game blows. It is anything but realistic. You are having to deal with the Queen of Spades far, far too often. It either gets dealt to you or passed to you way more frequently than it could with normal random dealing, which this game clearly does not use. If it isn't the Queen, then the game is dealing or passing you the Ace or King of Spades, or some combination of the three. It's totally blatant at the cheating too. For example, late in a game that you leading in it will pass you all three high spades as a group. Haha. How often have you ever seen that happen in a real game of Hearts? What a joke this game is.
Here's my new strategy. Whenever the chosen one shoots the moon....SWOOSH....new game. Sometimes I don't even finish that particular hand. I mean, you can see what's happening but don't have the cards to stop it and you know the bots never do (funny how that works out, eh?). So I just say forget that game and start a new one. I could care less about my "winning" percentage anyway since it doesn't mean squat on a game that is totally rigged. So, it's SWOOSH...new game.
I call bs on this game also.
I just lost two games in a row where the chosen one shot the moon on the last hand of the game and won, beating me by just a few points in the process both times. In the first game, it happened on hand #12 and in the second game it happened on hand #8. Gee, those were both no pass hands now, weren't they? Hmmmm.
Any Hearts game where you can consistently get stuck with the QS by throwing the 4D or 4C is cheating you. The cards must be stacked that way in order for that outcome to be achieved again and again. And stacking cards is cheating by anyone's definition.
If a bot shoots the moon on the first hand -KAWHOOSH
If I take 20+ points on the first hand - KAWHOOSH
If I see the "cutesy play" for a second time in a game - KAWHOOSH
If I see a lone QS,KS,or AS on a hold-em hand - KAWHOOSH
ARE YOU LISTENING MS? KAWHOOSH
I agree with the earlier poster regarding the program's emphasis on "cheating" the human rather than creating a better game. If it is possible to program all the "set-ups" to dump points on the human AND protect the "chosen one" (and YES, the chosen one IS protected) it should be possible to program realistic strategies and a true random deal.
I couldn't agree with you more Carl. The programmers really missed the mark on this game. The effect of the game constantly protecting the "chosen one" is to have players quickly tire of the game. The point of any computer game is to keep the player's interest. This game fails miserably at that. It quickly becomes a very repetitive and dull game imho.
I totally concur with those comments above. The sheer repetitiveness of being dealt or passed the 2 of Clubs makes this game a complete joke, for example. Why didn't the programmers try to make this game realistic? Did they think that by rigging the so-called deals it would make the game more challenging and thus interesting? Well, they were wrong.
Moon shots on the last hand to beat you are total BS. I too suspect that the cards in the bots hands are not actually fixed in place after the deal/pass. The moon shot that just beat me required an amazing knowledge of what to throw and exactly when to throw it.
Oh yeah, you, the human player, are the only one who doesn't get to see the other cards.
This game really is utter BS.
I couldn't agree more. I used to play the Windows version until I discovered how completely fixed it is. How stupid of them to make it that way. I play online now if I want to play a REAL game of Hearts.
Yeah, this game is piece of crap. That's why it's free. They would never be able to actually sell a game this bad. MS puts out a lot of crap products so I'm not surprised.
I just played a game wherein I was passed the QS 10 times in a game of 12 hands. 10 of 12! Yeah, it's a fair game.
Someone that has a wiki account should post an addition mentioning this blog and its discussion of the game's strategy of card rigging. I'd love to see if they keep it posted.
Correction to my post above...I should have said I was dealt OR passed the QS 10 times...in other words, I was looking at the QS before the hand started 10 of the 12 hands in that game. Totally unrealistic.
Yes. The deals are not random and thus the game is a farce. Play online if you like Hearts would be my suggestion.
There must have been some pretty weak programmers behind this game. The sheer repetition of the 2 of clubs tactic (for example) is a good indication of how desperate their game design became in the end. They needed to put this one back up on the board and just start over. It exudes laziness in its current form.
if I wanted to spend an evening watching cheating, I'd go play golf with my brother-in-law.
I must be the LeBron James of hearts. Last 3 games I've led by 7,12,&5 pts. Lost all three. I can play great 'til the last hand and then I turn in a total nincompoop.
Ever notice how often the deuce and ace of clubs come as a set? The frequency is multiple deviations away from a normal occurrence, i.e., it isn't by chance.
Haha. Love all the funny comments like those above. Those of us who have played this game for awhile can only laugh since we all know how ridiculously rigged this "game" is.
Man, you ain't LeBron. You've just been playing the Mavs. Last ten last hand losses the "chosen one" has taken 0-0-0-0-3-0-1-2-0-0 pts.
I think it's hysterical that they still try to pass this off as a legitimate game. It's a waste of hd space and they should just stop putting it out with every new version of Windows. Wake up MS.
Can't believe what I just saw. The game clearly violated the rules. I had a sure thing moon shot as I took the QS early (no choice on this really) and had all the high hearts except the JH. I got the jack when I led one of my high spades so I should have been home free. I'm throwing hearts and I notice on the last one that no more hearts are coming out from the bots but I only have 25 points. What the heck? Did I miss the first heart when hearts were broken? Nope. I took that trick. So, on the very last trick, East throws out the 8H and North takes the trick with a diamond higher than mine. It just so happens that East is the "chosen one" for this game. I can't believe the game resorts to outright cheating like this. Some others have mentioned this on this thread and now I'm a believer too.
THE GAME IS RIGGED. WE PROVED THIS IN A CLASS PROJECT AS WELL. YOU CAN WIN BUT OVER TIME YOU WILL LOSE MORE THAN YOU WIN. IF YOU LIKE PLAYING A RIGGED GAME, THEN GO FOR IT.
Had a 5-game winning streak.
Game 6 got the queen shoved down my throat first 4 hands
Had a 5-game winning streak.
Game 6 got the queen shoved down my throat first 4 hands
I agree that the game is extremely repetitive. I mean, how many times have you seen the left pass give you an Ace or King of Spades or both, East take the first trick, lead out with Spades, and then have West dump the Queen on you? It uses this tactic over and over and over again. That's just one example of course; there are plenty of others as you well know.
Thus, the game gets dull very quickly due to its sheer repetitiveness. Letting you win 40% or more of the time is supposed to counteract this decline in interest in the game. This is where the game designers got it wrong. If they had just wrote a program that used random dealing instead of card stacking it would have served their purpose better. Therefore, I'd also agree with the previous posters who give this game a failing grade.
Wow! This game is just amazingly rigged.
I just played a game of 8 hands in which the "chosen one" shot the moon 3 times. I could not pass that player (West) any points whenever I tried because the other bots jumped in to save his ass every time.
I think there are some games that you just cannot win no matter what because the card rigging is so intense and because the bots are all playing in unison really.
Any game that has to rely upon card rigging is corrupt. So, why does Microsoft put out a product that they know is corrupt?
For Vista and Win7 users....
To remove a Windows game from your Games folder:
1. Click the Start button Picture of the Start button, click Control Panel, click Programs, and then under Programs and Features, click Turn Windows features on or off.
2. Click the plus sign next to the Games check box, clear the check box next to the game you'd like to turn off, and then click OK.
The game won't appear in your Games folder unless you follow these steps again and select the check box.
If you'd like to temporarily hide a game without deleting it or turning the game on or off, you can do that instead.
Simple logic tells you that, in a random deal, your odds of getting one card are exactly the same as getting another card. I would bet the family beet farm that I gotten the QS as a singleton on a "no-pass" hand at least 25 times in the last 500 games, AND have not gotten at least half the f other cards even once. Absolutlely impossible odds, hundreds of digits.
You are right about the "impossible" odds. And ain't it amazing it would be the queen of spades? One night this week I was dealt lone QS on hold-em hands in back-to-back games and another time int he dozen or so games I played.
Overwhelming evidence you are be "given" the cards the game wants you to have.
That's exactly what is being done. You are given the cards the game wants you to have. Just played a game where I got the cutesy play (5H takes 4 pts.) the double cutesy (5H and 9H take 8 pts.) and the mini-cutesy twice (4H takes 3 pts). Cards PUT where human gets honked.
Yep, I've seen it hundreds of times. I hold the whole company responsible for the dishonesty and corruption of this pathetic "game".
Why does a company like MS encourage, tolerate, allow such dishonesty in their product? I can't believe these games aren't thoroughly tested before they're offered. It wouldn't take a half-way experienced heart player an afternoon to figure out the blant card-rigging, etc. If the programmer has the smarts to put in the hundreds of cheats, he could sure do a better job of creating a fair and realistic game.
Same horses***, won a game, first hand of next game dealt lone spade, passed queen, spades led twice, ate queen. Seen it a thousand times. Real clever, you f****8 cheat.
It is pathetic that any computer game would have cheating against the rules of play designed into it such as Windows Hearts does. Watch carefully and you'll see bots holding cards back in order to maximize damage to South. These cards usually will eventually get discarded on one of the last couple plays of the hand.
Totally pathetic.
I love how the moons shots are so easy for the chosen one (sometimes you don't have a single card to stop it) but then they always stack the cards in such a way on your attempt at a moon shot that you will get stuck with the QS but be unable to get one or two hearts. And if you attempt to abandon it toward the end of the hand, it's inevitable that the other player you generally are going head-to-head with (funny how it always works out that way) will have that one remaining spade to stick you with the Queen if you hold it until the last trick. It's so obvious that the cards are so seriously stacked on these hands. It's this sort of rigging that makes this game completely fake.
Just so we never forget how much smarter the programmer is than any of us - "the cutesy play". You get the five of hearts, each of the bots get the 2, 3, 4. You get 4 points and stay in the lead. Seems I get reminded of the programmer's brilliance at least once a game with this little nugget.
As far as I'm concerned, anyone connected to the development and programming of this game is a dishonest, corrupt, immoral cheat. I think I'd be less disgusted if the game had flaws or glitches than the purposeful "cheats" designed to make you lose the game. That crap is just plain sickening and whoever is responsible for it should be fired.
For me, I'm equally pissed at this "chosen one" crap. It is laughable the ploys used to protect this little a-hole. One of the favorite tricks is to deal "chosen one" void in spades. Then, while the other bots are leading at the QS (which is inevitably in your hand) he's dumping all his point-taking cards. I've seen nunerous hands where the chosen one one had to follow suit a couple of times, much less take a trick.
This is so amusing. Apparently, as part of their scheme for world domination, the lackeys at Microsoft have created a game of fiendish complexity. Deals are cooked to hurt the human player (note that the deals are always different, so a non-trivial algorithm is employed), the program devises playing strategies by looking at the cards in human players hand (another non-trivial algorithm), the computer players collude on card passing (wow, another one). It's so evil!
A quick peek at the 'about' box shows that it was developed for Microsoft by Oberon Games. In fact, I bet it's not Microsoft at ALL, well all know they are a bunch of incompetents. It's in fact Oberon Games that is duping Microsoft and guess who the hapless victims are? We are, that's who. I wonder what's the next step in Oberon Games subtle plan to unravel the very fabric of our culture. Before I play any game, I would check to make sure they're not behind it.
The ultimate irony is, after all that rather sophisticated programming, the game play itself is terrible. People routinely win 50% of their games on hearts. At the moment after a 4 game loss streak I'm at 1242/2240 for around 55%. That's about twice what you would expect if all players were equal. So they made the dealing and passing complex but made the game play terrible.
Oh, what an evil plot indeed.
P.S. after all that, I do think the deals may be a little suspect, as West seems to get the Queen all too often, and that 2-3-4-5 hearts thing does seem to happen a lot. I haven't measured it though, too lazy. Maybe that guy that had the statistics class can provide some actual numbers on it.
I don't recall seeing or saying anything about fiendish or evil. It IS very dishonest. I realize that, with 4 competent players, you'd win at about 25%. That's NOT the point. If I won 99% of the games and lost #100 because I was cheated, I'd be pissed.
*You ARE dealt cards detrimental to winning at a MUCH greater rate than the statistical norm.
*The game DOES "collude" to the disadvantage of the human. Pay attention to the disparity of spades led when you hold the queen and when you don't.
*The "last hand -crap hands" are specifically designed to make you LOSE - not make the game competitive.
I don't care who makes the game, they are a dishonest, immoral cheat.
I agree totally. It's butt-simple. If it's not a random deal, it's a selective deal. WHICH IS CHEATING!
There is absolutely no sensible person who can claim the deals are random.
The last poster is right. Pay attention to HOW you are getting stuck with points, HOW the cards are positioned, HOW things are set up to nail you. You'll see that the odds of the cards being where they need to be are way out of whack with what actually occurs.
It's not just with the QS either. Pay attention how many times you get stuck with hearts, or way more than you should have with the hand you had.
As a former game designer I can tell you that this game is not that sophisticated and, in fact, actually incorporates pretty amateurish programming at best. I can also tell you unequivocally that it does not randomly deal hands and thus is not a legitimate game of Hearts.
It is what it is I guess: a poorly deigned rigged game that I wouldn't get all that worked up over. In the gaming world, it's really considered pretty much a joke.
After having West dump the QS on me for the fourth time in a game that was only seven hands long (I could see it coming 3 of the 4 times but couldn't do anything about it)...SWOOSH...new game. That's my new strategy. Whenever the game pulls this kinda of crap.....SWOOSH....new game.
I won two games. Game 3 - first 3 hands dealt a lone spade - got passed king of spades - spades led - all three times west dumps queen. Hand #4 - dealt queen and ten of spades - two spade leads - ate it again.
All of you doubters and apologists out there - tell us again that the game doesn't cheat. If it's just "luck of the draw", why don't I see 2.3.4 of hearts 3 or 4 consecutive hands? Hmm?
The game uses blatant card rigging as its basis of play through the use of card sets with known probable point outcomes. It does NOT randomly deal as has been pointed out by many other posters already. Thus, the game is entirely BOGUS.
It's crap. Just more Windows bloatware. Hey, MS, get a clue!
COMPLETELY RIGGED GAME.
SO, YEAH, IT DEFINITELY QUALIFIES AS A CHEAT IN MY BOOK.
AND WHAT'S WITH THE REPETITIVENESS OF THE TACTICS? THAT 2 OF CLUBS THING IS JUST RIDICULOUS.
I AGREE WITH THE OVERALL ASSESSMENT OF THE POSTERS HERE. IT'S A TOTALLY CRAPPY ATTEMPT AT HEARTS.
Per notes from class project...
Even distribution of 2,3,4,5 of hearts in our data set of played games occurred in 83% of all hands.
Also, no other player is passed the high spades more often than South is. The rate was almost double the next closest player.
I cannot believe how often I am dealt a lone spade...and almost always am passed the queen to go with it.
Also, I get the lone QS on "no-pass" hand once a night (10-15 games). Should see that MAYBE once in 500 games? I do know you should see every other card in the deck as a singleton on a no-pass hand before you see the QS again.
Kept track of the 5,4,3,2 of hearts even distribution - I got the 5 nearly 60% of the time. Shouldn't that be more like 25%.
Pretty amazing how ALL the incredible anomalies are to your detriment.
The other way the game is rigged is by controlling the order of play. Of course, since the cards are placed in position and not actually dealt to any player, this is easy enough. Ever notice how often you are playing in front of West? Or how often West is void in the suit led by the other bots and ready to dump the Queen of Spades on you? It's all set up that way from the start of the hand.
It's actually a pretty unsophisticated game program. This is evident in the number of hands with x-x-0-0 and x-x-0-1 scores per game. This is due to the fact that the game constantly gives two players favorable hands (usually not South of course) every round.
I too agree with the earlier comments about the game being kind of a joke. It's too bad that the company that developed the game weren't better at game design. Hearts can be a fun game but this product really leaves a lot to be desired.
You're correct. The two of clubs routine is so overused that a seven-year-old is going to notice the trick. Obviously it's done for positioning and to possibly eliminate a pass card. But the reliance upon this little ploy again and again does indeed illustrate how poor the programming in the game is. It's a short cut essentially and its overuse exemplifies lazy programming at its "best".
Unbelievable. That's about all anyone can say about this game.
I just lost a game that I was leading in through 12 hands. On hand #13 I take the queen of spades (from West of course) with the 3 of diamonds on the second trick! I'm now still in the lead but the chosen one has gained on me (he didn't pick up any points on that hand). Then, on the very next hand, I get stuck with the queen again when I throw the 4 of clubs. The 4 of clubs! I can't believe it. Back to back stick me with the queen BS. One of the bots goes out and I lose to the chosen one by four points. Again, he didn't pick up any points on the last two hands of the game.
You guys got it right. This game is complete BS.
Yup. Pure unadulterated bs about sums that up. I got you beat though. I just played a game wherein I was dealt or passed the queen in all but one of 13 hands. 12 out of 13 times...yeah, that's possible.
Hand #12 (no-pass) my only card lower than a nine is the 3 of hearts (to go with A,K,Q). Only chance is a moon shot, which, of couse is foiled on the last trick. I take 24 and lose by 6. Great way yo make the game "competitive" MS.
Yup. What a coincidence of getting those particular cards "dealt" to you at that point in the game, eh? I've seen it many, many times. Your moon shot will either get ruined right from the start (hearts broken early and you miss that first heart) or at the very end with the "magical" ten or king of hearts trumping your lower heart. So, you end up with either 25 or 24 points which is always enough to cause you to not win at the end.
The game almost always uses the 8th and 12th hand to play "equalizer" when you are leading. Those hands will inevitably be x-x-0-0 scoring rounds, the result of you essentially going head-to-head with just one other player. The game uses this strategy very frequently throughout the game, but almost certainly in the above situation.
There is nothing random in this game, other than your own card play. The game knows what cards you're holding obviously (as well as all the other players) and really is only trying to make you lose. In the end, it's really not a game of Hearts at all since the bots are not actually trying to win the game. You can see this in the way that they do not try to flush out the QS when it's being held by one of their fellow bots. To the contrary, they are trying to stick you with it by creating a suit void in the hand of the bot that is holding it. They should just call this game "Stick South with the Queen of Spades" since it doesn't really play like a true game of Hearts.
I just caught the game violating the rules. North throws out the ace of hearts on the last trick but didn't throw any heart out a couple of tricks earlier. Wow is all I can say. I was leading the game by about 25 points when it pulls this stunt. If the ace had been thrown when called for I would have escaped with just the queen and a few other pointers, but, as it turned out, I got stuck with 25 points, thereby eliminating my lead in one fell swoop. Some others had commented before about the game outright cheating like this and now I believe it. I guess it thinks you won't notice such things since they happen right at the end before the cards get swept up.
I am so glad I found this blog. I am a very amateur player and have been trying to win three games in a row now for two weeks. I thought the reason that I was failing to do this was because I was getting tired and making basic mistakes after ten or twenty hands. I never realised he cards were - literally - stacked against me. Great blog, wonderful discussion.
Welcome to the blog.
Yes, this game is completely rigged from start to finish. It's actually pretty comical how blatantly rigged it is. I guess the game's programmers weren't smart enough in their design to be more discreet about their card stacking.
It's a crappy game and that's why it's free. Don't take it too seriously. It proves nothing about one's skill at playing a true game of Hearts.
In a truly random game, the difficulty of your hands should vary across the game. This game says the hell with that and if you are leading after say eight hands, your hands will inevitably get very difficult. They'll frequently look like moon shot hands but beware of this. Many of these hands are designed to look like that but are really set-ups for you to take a whole bunch of points.
Card stacking is cheating plain and simple. This whole game is based on that strategy so, yes, it cheats.
The lengths this game will go to protect the "chosen one" are ridiculous. I just played a game of 11 hands in which the chosen one went scoreless for 9 consecutive hands. Sure. That happens in a real game of Hearts all the time, right?
Gee, why is it that I'm forever picking up 13 or more points (QS and maybe one or two hearts) on hand #8 whenever I'm in the lead? Usually it gets dumped on me by West of course, who the game insists play after me again and again.
What a joke this thing is. The game, and I use that term loosely, gets very boring very quickly in my opinion. A game that didn't actually stack the cards against you would be far more interesting and thus keep one playing. Frankly, this thing is nothing but a waste of hard drive space.
Haha. Great blog.
I delete all ms games right away whenever I get a new computer. Their games suck and always have. You can always play a fair game of Hearts online. This piece of crap is not worth your time folks.
Is there actually a point to this game? Why would anyone want to play a card game that involves card stacking? The bigger question I guess is what kind of game company would design a game that incorporates such cheating?
All this game does is to keep passing you the high spades or trying to set you up take the queen. Over and over and over and over and over until you're entirely bored and don't play it any more.
Great strategy you got there game developers!
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